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May 22, 2012, 05:40:12 AM

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Author Topic: Big problem - POP email missing  (Read 1684 times)
Pogle
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« on: October 24, 2010, 04:39:48 AM »

I've slowly become aware that quite a lot of email sent to me hasn't arrived. Some does and some doesn't. I can't say for sure how much but I'm starting to think 50% or more is getting lost. The sender does not receive any notification so neither side knows it was lost.

I've asked my regular correspondents to copy any future mail to the problem account and to a working account so by comparing I can get an idea of the scale of the problem and will hopefully know when it's fixed.

I've tried various things but would like to know if there are any logging or debugging tools available. Ideally I'd like a list with one line for each email coming in, giving sender address, subject, date, time and an indication of how it was processed.

Are there any such tools I can install?

Thanks
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turula2
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Peter in DG


« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2010, 09:00:21 AM »

I wonder if there is some new "spam" filtering going on?  I used to get about 10 spam messages a day - mostly identified as such - but the last 5 days or so (since CP-11 was installed)  I've gotten just 2.

I do use "SpamAssassin" to identify and tag spam, but I have "Spam Auto Delete is Disabled" and "Spam Box is currently Disabled".  I wonder if these settings are not being interpreted properly under the new CP-11.
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Pogle
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« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2010, 03:22:02 AM »

Lucky you with just 10 spam a day. I get about 3,000! But most of these are to non-existent addresses on my domain so they're easy enough to filter out. I have a catchall/default address and leave the rest open in order to be able to generate other addresses easily without creating a new account on cPanel.

Shortly after my original post I changed the default address. It had been my main account (where I was losing mail) and I used filters to separate the spam from mail to legitimate addresses which gets redirected. Now I have a different account as default and I do user level filtering on that, leaving my main account for its own mail only. So far there've been no problems, based on people copying to another working account. But I've also stopped using my android phone for mail in case that was the problem (it started around the time I started using the phone for email). I'll restart using the phone when I'm really confident things are OK.

Because the spam to non-existent addreses is discarded silently (without notification) I wonder if it makes a target for spammers. Do they mail random addresses on a domain to see if they get a notification? If so, the problem now is that if I set up a notification email for non-existent addresses I'll be sending out 3,000 bounces every day to the poor people whose address is being spoofed. Or maybe all domains are being equally but invisibly hammered by spam to non-existent addresses.

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darkwolf
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« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2010, 09:51:21 PM »

Was your android phone using pop?

For phones I recommend setting them up to use IMAP, especially if you are going to use  another email client to check email.
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Pogle
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« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2010, 12:47:55 PM »

Thanks Troy,
yes it is POP and yes I have been thinking about IMAP. But IMAP seems to be more of a server-based system and I've always just downloaded my mail to a client. I have Thunderbird on the PC and set it to leave mail on the server for two days so I can still download it to the phone if I've gone out with the PC left on. And the phone is set not to delete after downloading. It ought to work. In fact it did work and I've no proof that that's why I'm losing mail. That's why I was wondering if there's some sort of logging or debugging that I can enable to find out what's happening.
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darkwolf
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« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2010, 04:03:35 PM »

Nothing I can think of off hand.

If you know for sure when an email was sent, the sending email address, the receiving email address and the subject, you may be able to contact support at support@lunarpages.com or via support.lunarpages.com and it may be possible to check and see if the email came into LP servers.

Generally this has to be done within 24 hours of the email being sent.

I usually recommend using IMAP on phones because I have seen some issues where phones will download the email via POP , be set to keep copy on server, but not do so.  I have also seen this occur with mail clients on local computers as well, however have seen it most often with phones.

The way to tell if this may be occurring is if one system receives the email (for example phone) but the other does not.

If neither system is receiving email from a particular email address, you may want to try disabling any filtering or forwarding you may be doing and make sure to whitelist the sender.
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Pogle
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« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2010, 05:23:03 AM »

...I have seen some issues where phones will download the email via POP , be set to keep copy on server, but not do so.  I have also seen this occur with mail clients on local computers as well, however have seen it most often with phones.
Thanks Troy. That would almost fit with the symptoms. The phone polls and wrongly deletes email from the server; at the next poll the email disappears from the phone because it's no longer on the server (that's how I have it configured). And of course the PC might miss the mail between its own polls. The only thing is that I would have expected to hear the email notification on the phone. It would be interesting to know exactly which OS and mail software shows this problem. It can't be all phones.

Unfortunately I rarely detect a lost email within 24 hours. At the moment it seems OK. I think that changing my main personal account not to be the catchall might have had an effect although if the filters are working OK it shouldn't make a difference.

I use a regex match to select To addresses.
Code:
(?<!name1|name2|name3)[@]domain\.tld
It's a 'negative look-behind assertion' that says if you do NOT have any of these names immediately preceding @domain then it's a match to be discarded or rerouted. (It also matches longer name strings that end in name1, etc. but that suits my purposes.) It has always worked in the past but I wonder if it's CPU intensive and fails at times of high spam. It filters about 3,000 invalidly addressed spams each day.

Anyway, this filter is no longer applied to the account but just to the user which is the new catchall.
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darkwolf
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« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2010, 05:29:38 AM »

Not sure which type of account your on, but if your on cpanel, you shouldnt (far as I know) have to setup a separate filter to route to a catchall. 

As for the email issue, to see if that is the cause, try setting up a new account, setup both outlook and your phone the same as you did the previous account, and see what happens.

Best option however, probably be go to IMAP, but make sure your quotas are set high in your website control panel.

I have seen it occur on the iphone when I was setting up for one of my g/f's clients.

Most of the time however when I think this is occurring, and I recommend the user go to IMAP, I usually don't hear back from the person reporting the issue and unfortunantly most of the time that this occurs, people don't always tell me what type of phone they are doing it from.
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